Quidditch Cup 1991 and earlier
I've been trying to find verification on who won the Cup in Harry's first year and before. I seem to recall someone saying that Slytherin had won it, but I've only found references saying they won the HOUSE Cup during that time, not the Quidditch Cup. If anyone can find a source or reference, it would be appreciated. Here's everything I've found so far: - Nick O'Demus 10:54, September 17, 2009 (UTC)
- "I hope you're going to help us win the house championship this year? Gryffindors have never gone so long without winning. Slytherins have got the cup six years in a row!"
- —PS, ch.7, p.124: "House championship", not Quidditch.
- "I tell you, we're going to win that Quidditch Cup for sure this year. We haven't won since Charlie left [...]"
- —PS, ch.9, p.153: Charlie graduated right before Harry started, so that isn't saying much. However, it's said in PoA (see below), that Gryffindor hadn't won for (at that point) seven years.
- "Gryffindor had won by 170 points to 60."
- —PS, ch.11, p.191: Scores from Gryffindor vs. Slytherin.
- "We've won Gryffindor is in the lead!"
- —PS, ch.13, p.224: Gryffindor takes the lead after beating Hufflepuff. Also, as the game only lasted five minutes, it's unlikely either side would've gained many points through goals.
- "Harry gasped - they would lose the lead, the lead he'd won in the last Quidditch match."
- —PS, ch.15, p.244-245: McGonagall docks them 50 points, proving Quidditch points are applied to the House cup. However she goes on to specify 50 points "each" AFTER he thinks this, so it's unclear just how many of the Quidditch points are applied.
- "The points are all in and Slytherin won, of course - you missed the last Quidditch match, we were steamrolled by Ravenclaw without you [...]"
- —PS, ch.17, p.302: Seems to indicate Quidditch Cup, but he may also have been referring to the House Cup total.
- "[...] to celebrate Slytherin's winning the house cup for the seventh year in a row."
- —PS, ch.17, p.304: HOUSE cup, not Quidditch.
- "[...] in third, Hufflepuff, with 352; Ravenclaw has 426 and Slytherin, 472."
- —PS, ch.17, p.305: Point totals after McGonagall had docked them 150, but before Dumbledore awards 160. Slytherin in the lead, Ravenclaw not too far behind, and Hufflepuff (after Gryffindor gets their points back) DEAD LAST.
Chamber of Secrets
- "Now, listen here, you lot. We should have won the Quidditch cup last year."
- —CoS, ch.7, p.108: Confirms Gryffindor did not win in PS.
- "Harry shifted guiltily in his seat. He had been unconscious in the hospital wing for the final match of the previous year, meaning that Gryffindor had been a player short and had suffered their worst defeat in three hundred years."
- —CoS, ch.7, p.109: Gryffindor vs. Ravenclaw. However, this refers only to defeat in an individual game, it's verified later that they did NOT come in last in the overall championship. See HBP.
- "Excellent flying yesterday, really excellent. Gryffindor has just taken the lead for the House Cup - you earned fifty points!"
- —CoS, ch.11, p.183: Again confirms that Quidditch points are applied to the House Cup, 50 points in this case.
Prisoner of Azkaban
- "This is our last chance - my last chance - to win the Quidditch Cup. [...] Gryffindor hasn't won for seven years now."
- —PoA, ch.8, p.143: Depending on how this is meant, Gryffindor would have won in 1985 or 1986. It's not yet specified who did win in those years though.
- "I don't know why you're worried, Oliver, Hufflepuff is a pushover. Last time we played them, Harry caught the Snith in about five minutes, remember?"
- —PoA, ch.9, p.169: Indicating it's even less likely Hufflepuff won the Quidditch Cup in PS. (The Gryffindor-Hufflepatch had been cancelled in CoS.)
- "Slytherin was leading the tournament by exactly 200 points. This meant (as Wood constantly reminded his team) that they needed to win by the match by more than that amount to win the Cup."
- —PoA, ch.15, p.300: Confirms the Quidditch Cup is won by point totals, not number of wins.
- "So you must catch it only if we're more than 50 points up. Only if we're more than 50 points up, Harry, or we win the match but lose the Cup."
- —PoA, ch.15, p.300: Same as above.
- "Gryffindor House, meanwhile, largely thanks to their spectacular performance in the Quidditch Cup, had won the House championship for the third year running."
- —PoA, ch.22, p.430: Again confirms that Quidditch points are applied to the House Championship.
Order of the Phoenix
- "I've become accustomed to seeing the Quidditch Cup in my study, boys, and I really don't want to have to hand it over to Professor Snape, so use the extra time to practise, won't you?"
- —OotP, ch.19, p.400: McGonagall doesn't specify if she'd be handing it back, though.
- "Interest in the Gryffindor-Ravenclaw game was running extremely high throughout the school, for the match would decide the Championship, which was still wide open. If Gryffindor beat Ravenclaw by a margin of 300 points [...] thewn they would win the Championship. If they won by less than 300 points, they would come in second to Ravenclaw; if they lost by 100 points they would be third behind Hufflepuff and if they lost by more than 100, they would be in fourth place and nobody, Harry thought, wouold ever, ever let him forget that it had been he who had captained Gryffindor to their first bottom-of-the-table defeat in two centuries."
- —HBP, ch.24, p.520: Complete rundown of how the points of Gryffindor vs. Ravenclaw determine Gryffindor's place in the overall championship. As it says that it would be their "first bottom-of-the-table defeat in two centuries", this means Gryffindor did NOT come in last in PS despite their crushing defeat by Ravenclaw.
TL;DR at bottom
Just looked into the 91-92 result and came up with these results (NB. These results assume that the system works as in football, with wins used and points to settle a tie.
There are eight results possible using the matches we know (the Gryffindor ones) and speculating the previous 3. The results are as follows, the first team denotes the winner of Ravenclaw/Hufflepuff, the second Slytherin/Ravenclaw and the third Slytherin/Hufflepuff. These findings assume that the match between Gryffindor/Ravenclaw ended with a sufficiently high points win for Ravenclaw to almost garuntee victory in a points tiebreak, and Gryffindor to lose a tiebreak, due to it being Gryffindor's worst loss in two centuries
1) Hufflepuff/Slytherin/Slytherin - Slytherin win on points presumably because of Gryffindor/Ravenclaw
2) Ravenclaw/Slytherin/Slytherin- Ravenclaw win on points amassed by winning against Gryffindor
3) Hufflepuff/Slytherin/Hufflepuff- Hufflepuff beat Gryffindor on points
4) Ravenclaw/Slytherin/Hufflepuff- Ravenclaw beat Gryffindor on points
5) Hufflepuff/Ravenclaw/Slytherin- Ravenclaw beat Gryffindor and Slytherin on points
6) Hufflepuff/Ravenclaw/Hufflepuff- Ravenclaw beat Hufflepuff and Gryffindor on points
7) Ravenclaw/Ravenclaw/Hufflepuff- Ravenclaw secure a clean sweep of wins
8) Ravenclaw/Ravenclaw/Slytherin- Ditto, 3 wins out of 3 for Ravenclaw.
So what can we conclude from this? Well, 6 times out of 8, a 75% majority in favour of Ravenclaw, with an outside shot at Slytherin or Hufflepuff winning. A further analysis shows that Gryffindor must either finish 2nd or 3rd, with Ravenclaw finishing 1st or 3rd (Hufflepuff and Slytherin can fit in anywhere) Based on probability, the results are as follows.
1st) Ravenclaw (6 wins out of 8)
2nd) Gryffindor (5 seconds out of 8)
3rd) Slytherin (1.5 thirds out of 8)
4th) Hufflepuff (4.5 fourths out of 8)
Note: The half points origionate from idea 4, where either Slytherin or Hufflepuff could take third (not enough info). Both Slytherin and Hufflepuff also share 1.5 out of 8 third places, but Hufflepuff were demoted because of its higher chance of fourths (4.5 to 3.5).
Apologies if I have confused anyone here, this is just my logical thinking.
- But the cup isn't awarded based on "wins", it's based on points. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 22.214.171.124 (talk • contribs).
- Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban, chapter 15, page 300.
- Slytherin was leading the tournament by exactly 200 points. This meant (as Wood constantly reminded his team) that they needed to win the match by more than that amount to win the Cup. This also meant that the burden of winning fell largely on Harry, because capturing the Snitch was worth 150 points. "So you must catch it only if we're more than fifty points up," Wood told Harry constantly. "Only if we're more than fifty points up, Harry, or we win the match but lose the Cup."
- Also, in Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince, chapter 24, page 520, Harry runs through how the points from the championship match against Ravenclaw would determine Gryffindor's placement in the tournament, from first through last:
- Win by 300+ = Gryffindor wins the Cup
- Win by less than 300 = Ravenclaw wins the Cup, Gryffindor 2nd place
- Lose by 100 = Ravenclaw wins, Hufflepuff 2nd place, Gryffindor 3rd
- Lose by 100+ = Gryffindor 4th place