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First Battle of Hogwarts

This page doesn't seem to be needed as Second Battle of Hogwarts has all the relevant information on this subject.

--BogeyHex 21:10, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

When was the First Battle of Hogwarts? Plumber
The "First battle of Hogwarts" is a term to refer to the battle of the Astronomy Tower (or Lightning Struck Tower) which resulted in Dumbledore's death. Lord Opeth 20:09, 10 December 2007 (UTC)

Is Dolohov dead?

Did Flitwick kill Dolohov or not? -Matoro183 (Talk) 13:23, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

I think that he did not. He only fell with a scream. During the battle in the Department of Mysteries, Kingsley also fell with a scream at Bellatrix hands. Flitwick may have created a spell like the one Bellatrix used on Kingsley, or casted the Cruciatus Curse on Dolohov, or anything else; remember Flitwick was a duel champion. Lord Opeth 20:09, 10 December 2007 (UTC)

victory song

WE DID IT WE BASHED THEM WEE POTTER'S THE ONE, NOW VOLDY'S GONE MOULDY LETS HAVE SOME FUN!!!!!!!

Lol—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Mainiac 1 (talkcontribs).

List of known participants and Suvivors?

I think it could be interesting a list of people (by name) that batled and the ones who we known have survided.

Also, does anyone remeber if any Slytherins fought for Hogwarts side? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Bluelantern (talkcontribs).

At least Professor Slughorn fought for Hogwarts. Heads- no he didn't!!!! It says in the book he was fighting a weasly!! They ALL fought for Hogwarts.....duh!---- -- DarkJedi613 (Talk) 06:29, 20 January 2008 (UTC)
I believe that JK (in the recent PotterCast interview) mentioned that some Slytherins (none by name) returned with Slughorn at the end of the battle. JK said that Slytherins were pragmatic, with a greater sense of self-preservation, so left and returned with reinforcements. - Cavalier One(Wizarding Wireless Network) 11:31, 20 January 2008 (UTC)

Under combatants it says one giant participated. But didn't Grawp fight another giant? Gwenog Jones 20:11, 15 February 2009 (UTC)

Wait a second. I read that same interview with JKR, and Slytherins were on Hogwarts' side. So, why are they listed under DSeath Eater side? On Death Eater side, it says several Slytherin students, which is wrong by itself. Only Malfoy, Crabbe and Goyle returned. The rest left for reinforcements. I am deleting that part and moving Slytherin students to Hogwarts' side. --Arculus Ambleway 12:27, April 25, 2010 (UTC)Arculus Ambleway--Arculus Ambleway 12:27, April 25, 2010 (UTC)

"If your son is dead, Lucius, it is not my fault. He did not come and join me, like the rest of the Slytherins."
—Deathly Hallows, ch. 32, p.641[src]

Fair quote, but JKR nonetheless stated very clearly that Slytherins left Hogwarts to gather reinforcements consisting of Hogsmeade residents and family and friends of students and teachers behind Slughorn. This makes contradictory information. If JKR contradicts herslef, the newest information is to be take as canon, according to Wiki: canon. Maybe some slytherins fought with and some against, but we dont know. All we know is what JKR said, so there you go. I wil change it so that there were Slytherins on both sides. Remember Phienas Nigellus said after the battle so its clear to everyone: Slytherin played its part in the battle. --Arculus Ambleway 09:24, May 6, 2010 (UTC)

It's very possible that Voldemort is mistaken; he believes that the Slytherins left because they did not support Hogwarts, not because they were going to get reinforcements. I mean, if you weren't aware that they were coming back with support, what would you think if all the Slytherins left when Voldemort tells the students to leave?Hermeowone 23:54, July 4, 2010 (UTC)

Or it could mean that most Slytherins joined Voldemort, some left, and a few came back with SLughorn. Alumeng 20:17, October 24, 2011 (UTC)


So, anyone could explain why pretty much all the grown-up wizards, except for a handful of Hogwards teachers, were on the Death Eater side? - Passer-by, 02:22, Novermber 5, 2011 (UTC)

That wasn't exactly the case. The only people they could reach soon enough to participate in the battle were the Order and the teachers. the Death Eaters just had an easier way to get people to come fight with them. Most of the Ministry and all of the Death Eaters were fighting Hogwarts, and there were a lot of kids fighting on the good side. Alumeng 21:20, November 10, 2011 (UTC)

Is it just me, or did Slughorn accidentally fight on both sides in the war?

"...and Harry saw Charlie Weasley overtaking Horace Slughorn..." American version p. 734 par. 2. This quote shows us Slughorn is fighting against Hogwarts because Charlie is obviously fighting for Hogwarts. "Voldemort was now dueling McGonagall, Slughorn, and Kingsley all at once..." American Version p. 735 par. 5. This shows that Slughorn was fighting for Hogwarts. Was he Imperioed by a Death Eater? I am confused!!! —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 173.63.192.228 (talkcontribs).

I think all that was meant by that was that he was in a hurry and he ran past him. It says that there were people storming up the front steps, so it just meant that everyone was in a hurry and Charlie scrambled past him. ProfessorTofty 16:42, February 18, 2012 (UTC)

Anniversary

Anniversary of the defiting of Lord Voldemort.Yay--HallieryElizabeth 01:44, 3 May 2008 (UTC)

yes grawp fougt a giant 

—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.246.38.171 (talkcontribs).

Dumbledore's Demise

I have changed the description of Severus Snape's action resulting in the death of Albus Dumbkledore from "murdered" to "killed." It was made clear in "The Prince's Tale," and reiterated in the confrontation between Harry Potter and Lord Voldemort that Snape's action was the result of an agreed-upon procedure between him and Dumbledore. "Murder" implies malicious intent; "kill" is neutral, and the act was, in effect, a mercy killing. ~~Squadron4959 24 January 2009

I completely agree with your edit. Since the release of DH, most articles on this wiki have used the term "killed" when discussing Snape's role in Dumbledore's death, but this instance seems to have been overlooked. It's probably a hangover from the time between HBP and DH when it was still uncertain which side Snape was serving. Starstuff (Owl me!) 15:44, 24 January 2009 (UTC)

Death Eater support

Where is the proof that the Death Eaters were reinforced by Aurors and Ministry officials? Thicknesse being there means nothing, as he was under the Imperius Curse. Toon Ganondorf (t c) 11:16, 30 May 2009 (UTC)

I agree. If this information cannot be verified, then it should be removed. Starstuff (Owl me!) 23:46, 4 June 2009 (UTC)

The Ministry was split in Book 7. Some with Voldemort and some against. The ones who were against were sacked or killed. Some were Imperiused. People like Umbridge would likely have fought for the Death Eaters, especially if Pius was there. So, Ministry officials in the top Departments were with the Death Eaters. But I have a problem with Aurors supporting the Death Eaters. All Aurors, no matter what, know full well that the Death Eaters r the ones using the Dark Arts, killing Muggles and Muggle-born's, and would not fight against Hogwarts unless they were Imperiused and had a weak mind, which is unlikely on both accounts. That said, Aurors supporting the Death Eaters as stated in the first round section must be deleted. I also agree that it is not verified. Ministry officials are more likely. Arculus Ambleway 18:35, May 8, 2010 (UTC)

Date of Battle

Didn't the Battle of Hogwarts first start in the evening and draw to a close after midnight? I'm pretty sure it did, and if so surely the dates for the Battle of Hogwarts should be: May 2nd - May 3rd 1998

It officially started at midnight, per Voldemort's ultimatum to hand over Harry Potter, and ended at dawn with Voldemort's death. Nick O'Demus 03:35, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

When did J.K.Rowling actually say that it happened on May 2? I have never read anywhere that it happened on May 2. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 9311927LVorTMR (talkcontribs).

In J.K. Rowling: A Year in the Life. --  Seth Cooper  owl post! 22:14, January 4, 2010 (UTC)
[Edit conflict] She said it in the A Year in the Life documentary, which aired on TV in the UK in 2007, and was released on the Half-Blood Prince 2-Disc DVD and Blu-Ray: "Victoire, who's in the epilogue, was so named because she was born on the anniversary of the battle that finished it all. Which is the second of May, if anyone's been paying attention.". Starstuff (Owl me!) 22:50, January 4, 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, I haven't watched that part on my DVD yet, I prefer reading, so I've been looking for articles.


I think it started around 8:00 then at about 11:00 Voldemort stoped it for an hour to give people a chance to turn Harry in to the Death Eaters and then he turned himself in then he came back to life and he was carried out of the forest and got away under the invisibility cloak and then Voldy realized it and the battle went on and at dawn Harry defeated Voldy.
No Harry and crew arrived at 11ish Voldemort gave his warning at 1130ish and the battle started at midnight. Voldemort died a little before dawn, so the 1st part of the battle must've ended around 3 or 4 in the morning. Alumeng 20:21, October 24, 2011 (UTC)

Date of the destruction of Marvolo Gaunts ring.

How is the date of the destruction of gaunts ring known? Also, is it the 16th, or the 26th of July, as an anon changed it to 16th and I do not know whether it is right or not. -- Ratneer Owl Me! 02:58, December 16, 2009 (UTC)

Bumped -- Ratneer Owl Me! 00:14, December 18, 2009 (UTC)
I don't think we can pin down the exact date of the ring's destruction, but Dumbledore and Harry went to visit Slughorn on July 12, 1996 (HBP4), and Dumbledore's hand was already damaged at the point. We also see Snape containing the curse in Dumbledore's hand shortly after the ring's destruction in DH33, and during the scene, Dumbledore instructs Snape to help Draco with the mission given to him by Voldemort, which presumably means that the ring's destruction preceded Snape's Vow to Narcissa. Starstuff (Owl me!) 08:23, December 20, 2009 (UTC)

Template

Hello, I usually don't ask these types of questions, but what is the name of the template that you used for the BOH e.g.: infobox. --KiumaruHamachi 02:58, February 13, 2010 (UTC)KiumaruHamachi

It is called simply "Battle infobox."--L.V.K.T.V.J.Hogwarts(Send an owl!) 04:05, February 13, 2010 (UTC)

Thanks cuz i was looking for my wiki... i don't want to steal yours but i was looking use the word "Battle" in Wikia Templates Search. --KiumaruHamachi 04:08, February 13, 2010 (UTC)KiuamruHamachi

Dementors

Did anyone get kissed by dementors ? And also, how did dementors “die” ? 75.27.36.231 02:21, October 21, 2010 (UTC)

No one knows if anyone was kissed by the dementors during the Battle of Hogwarts. J.K. Rowling has not confirmed that yet. I think dementors probably fade out somehow when their is no more despair to feed on but again, that is a question for J.K. Rowling. Gryffindor1991 03:50, October 21, 2010 (UTC)

Deathly Hollows Part 2??

I keep seeing spoilers and pics from Deathly Hollow Part 2... has it aired yet? I'm confused... Buffymybasset--Buffy

16:59, March 18, 2011 (UTC)

Hiya Buffy! Things work a bit differently here than on the True Blood Wiki. We don't have spoiler warnings, or a time frame for releasing information. As soon as details or images from the film become available we update the relevent articles, regardless of weather or not the film has been released. Jayden Matthews 17:38, March 18, 2011 (UTC)

Picture description

Hey guys! I have a slight issue, though some may think it small. Under the Fall of the Dark Lord section, there is a picture of Voldemort standing in the Forbidden Forest with his Death Eaters. The caption underneath said photo states Voldemort and his Death Eaters after "Harry's Death". I think it more likely that this picture is depicting the scene where Harry willingly walks into the Death Eater's camp. I say this because they are all, Voldemort including, looking at something and the expressions are dumbfounded, because Voldemort came to the conclusion that Harry was not going to show up, claiming he was mistaken, and then Harry revealed himself. I couldn't figure out how to change the caption(the photo didn't show up in the editing page) so if anybody agrees with me, I think it should be changed. Thanks!Drummerwiz92 04:17, April 19, 2011 (UTC)

after a lot of thought i do agree because there is a look of surprise on their faces Jin kazama7 08:29, April 19, 2011 (UTC)

I do not agree. As shown in the very first trailer for Deathly Hallows, Voldemort's expression does not look surprised or dumbfounded at all. The only time when it changed was when he turned around, somewhat of a smile was on his face, but it left.

Also, I don't see the faces as nessesarily dumbfonded, but more waiting-in-anticipation... waiting for the answer. But still, it has been confirmed in the film that that picture does not occur at all, and by the time Voldemort has turned around to face Harry, Bellatrix has backed off. AlastorMoody 06:31, July 19, 2011 (UTC)

Post Part 2 Trailer Changes

I personally find all the added images since the release of the new trailer very irksome. Some are not in the right order or are duplicated later on in the article and do not match with the text they appear alongside. Also, the quote at the top of the article is taken from the trailer of DH part 2 and takes place in a context that is radically different from the way events took place in the book. Surely such a thing should be included in a page or section dedicated to differences between the book and the film or even a page depicting the film version of the battle while the primary purpose of this page, as with every other, should be to represent what took place in the book. The final fight between Harry and Voldemort looks to be very different in the film, therefore I suggest that any images or quotes from this fight be included elsewhere.

Disagree.. So what if the final battle was different in the films and let's face it: No one liked JK Rowling's book version of the final duel or at least not most of the people becaues the battle was only one paragraph long and two spells were used: expelliurmus and Avada Kedavra. The film version of the Battle has been suggested by the producers and Rowling has agreed on it (just like she has to agree on everything in the film series) and so it is counted as part of the Harry Potter series. The film version of the Battle is epic and is much better. German eagle logo  Firefox1095  German eagle logo 01:00, May 3, 2011 (UTC)
Hem, hem (imitating Umbridge voice). "Rowling's Word is Law." This is from the official policy page for the Harry Potter Wiki. While JKR may may approved or even made suggestions for the films, she did not write the scripts, therefore anything listed as canon universe from the films that is not corroborated in the books or in a public statement from JKR is a violation of HP Wiki stated policy. Personal opinions on version preferences are totally irrelevant. There is a section at the bottom of the page for differences in the film, and I believe that is appropriate, as it is titled that way. Oftenl8 18:20, July 27, 2011 (UTC)
Exactly. As the film contradicts the book in this matter, the battle in the catwalks/"let's finish this the way we started it"/courtyard cannot ever be considered canon. According to our canon policy, material from the films/games is only considered canon IF and only IF it doesn't contradict the books or Rowling's statements. --  Seth Cooper  owl post! 18:08, July 27, 2011 (UTC)
Ah, thanks for clearing that up. Oftenl8 03:09, July 28, 2011 (UTC)

1997, not 1998.

On JKR's site, you will find a family tree that says Fred died in 1997. Fred died in the Battle of Hogwarts. So, the Battle of Hogwarts happened in 1997. I can give you the link, if you want.

JKR has admitted that maths is not her strong suit. She forget that the Battle took place after New year. Harry was born on 31 July 1980, but the battle took place in May. --Rodolphus 17:24, May 3, 2011 (UTC)Ponyofishy 17:25, May 3, 2011 (UTC)

Ohh. Thank you!

Actually it is 1997. I just wrote out every year how old harry would be. he would still be 17 at the battle about to turn 18 and if you add up all the numbers, it is still 1997. so the JK was right when she said Fred died in 1997 —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 99.19.48.143 (talkcontribs).

While you're correct that Harry is almost 18 when the battle occurs, you're math is off on the rest. Consider the information from the book itself:
  1. Harry's birthday is July 31st. - (ch. 1, 4 & 7) The Order moves him from Privett Drive a few days before his 17th birthday. The party is held at the Burrow before the wedding.
  2. Harry's parents died on October 31st, 1981 - (ch. 16) The dates on their grave.
  3. Harry's parents were killed after his 1st birthday - (ch. 10) Lily's letter to Sirius.
  4. So, Harry's birthday is July 31st, 1980. 1980 + 17 years = 1997, which is the start of the book. Harry then spends nearly a year on the run while hunting Horcruxes. The break-in of the Ministry occurs in September (ch. 12), the attack at Godric's Hollow is around Christmas (ch. 16), and the trio's capture by Snatchers is in March of the next year (ch. 22).
  5. This puts the Battle of Hogwarts (ch. 31) in late spring of 1998.
Nick O'Demus 21:34, May 13, 2012 (UTC)

Quote at top

Um. Where is this quote found? In my version(the American version) Harry and Voldemort duel in the Great Hall. There is no mention of both of them in the Astronomy Tower at the same time unless I missed it(unlikely) is it in a foreign version?. Please list page # if It is in American version thankS~~Kevin

It's from the trailer for Deathly Hallows: Part 2. Whether it actually appears in the film is TBD. --Cubs Fan (Talk to me) 05:24, May 9, 2011 (UTC)
It's non-canon at any rate, as it doesn't happen in the book. Jayden Matthews 08:32, May 9, 2011 (UTC)

3 giants not 1

There were 3 giants participating in the Battle of Hogwarts. Hagrids half brother and 2 other giants controlled by the death eatters. They get their eyes scratched out by the hipogriff and thressels whilst Gwarp pummels them


Btw when harry was uncouncious what was the baby like creature that Dumbledore said he could not help. What was that creature?...I had an inkling it was Volde...he who must not be named =P


Thats because it was Voldemort. and you are correct about the giants.. Voldemort brought two and then Grawp was also there. Gryffindor1991 21:48, May 23, 2011 (UTC)

Movie or Book?

This topic seems to be describing the battle of Hogwarts in the movie, although there is a link to it from HP7 the book. I would guess so, because it is missing many crucial scenes (such as Ron and Hermione's kiss), and in many places seems to be an overview. Therefore, I would suggest deleting the link from the book's page, or creating a new page to link to the book.

Voldemort's Spell

In the Battle of Hogwarts, Voldemort casts a spell to defeat Protego Maxima. What spell does he use? Dement0r 16:30, June 27, 2011 (UTC)

It isn't mentioned exactly what it is, but there is a wiki page for it called Tom Riddle's unidentified spell. AlastorMoody 22:24, July 29, 2011 (UTC)

Lavender Brown a Casualty?

Lavender Brown is mentioned as dead in the battle. Her fate was never confirmed, but when I saw the movie at the midnight showing briefly it shows Parvati Patil and Terawnley placing a black cloth over the body. This leads me to think it could have been Lavender as she is no longer seen on the side in the movie.

We're told that some fifty unnamed others died during or from wounds received in the battle, so unless there is something definitve one way or the other, the possibility remains that one of those deaths was Lavender. Oftenl8 03:14, July 28, 2011 (UTC)

Well in the movie you see Fenrir Greyback over her body before Hermione kills him but apparently you see her feebly stir, so you can't say it's a casualty because it's unknown whether she survived.

The1Camel

No, I'm pretty sure that she's dead in the movie. First, Greyback was literally eating her, and then you see Parvati and Trelawney cover up the dead body later while in the Great Hall. When you say "apparently", it sounds like that's what you've heard and you're disbelieving. Lavender definitely stirs feebly in the book, indicating that she may still be alive, but it is almost certain that she's dead in the movie since she was being eaten and that a blanket was put over he motionless body.Insert non-formatted text here--~~~~

The body that Paravti Patil and Terawlney covered up was that on the unideified famale Hogwarts professor. http://harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Unidentified_female_Hogwarts_teacher

QueenSno 13:48, August 15, 2011 (UTC)

remus lupin death?

The man said to have been killed by a Death Eater who then begins a duel with Mr. Weasley, Remus Lupin could be, since he was protecting the place along with Kingsley and the Death Eater has a certain resemblance to Dolohov.

Why do all of the awesome characters have 2 die?! R.I.P. Remus Lupin

We have a page for the guy killed I don't quite know where we got the picture but no one's objected so I think it's the guy in the picture not lupin. And we see where Lupin is fighting, which appears to be farther away and near Tonks, whos nowhere near during that scene. Alumeng 20:29, October 24, 2011 (UTC)

Protection

In the movie, we see Filius Flitwick, Molly Weasley and Horace Slughorn cast protective spells but, when shows the castle from a up view, in the image, can be seen four people casting the spells, and I don't know who is that one. Sugestion??Dobby4ever 15:39, August 28, 2011 (UTC)

Of those professors that have been featured in the film could be the fourth Pomona Sprout, Sybill Trelawney, or Unidentified female Hogwarts teacher. Septima Vector

Info Box

I noticed that Hermione isn't mentioned by name in the info box. I'm assuming that she is supposed to fall under the "Weasley Family" bit, but since she wasn't married into the family at the time, I think her name should be added.

Aftermath

Hey whats going on with the aftermath? isn't it just the whole thing in between Voldemort's death and the beginning of the epilogue? Should there be a summary, not just a copy and paste from the book? Alumeng 20:30, October 24, 2011 (UTC)

Indeed, practically this whole article needs to be entirely rewritten (which is probably why that template is up there). Large chunks of it are copied straight from the book, with original writing really only serving to connect parts where dialog and overly descriptive statements were removed. I'll get right on that. -- 1337star (talk) 22:55, October 24, 2011 (UTC)
Uh, actually, this article is a lot longer than I thought (though not all of it is in bad shape, some of it is perfectly fine. I will try to work on it if it still needs it, but it'll have to be later when I have the time (and attention span) to dedicate to the task. -- 1337star (talk) 23:20, October 24, 2011 (UTC)
Yeah I was reading it and I've been reading some of the other battle articles is this supposed to be in past or present tense? i know that objects are supposed to be present and people past, but what about battles and skirmish's? most of the other articles are in past. Alumeng 22:00, October 26, 2011 (UTC)

Ha when i saw the Skirmish at the Great Hall i saw voldemort killing Neville but in the end he does not die.--86.30.202.147 10:01, November 5, 2011 (UTC)

Limbo and Dumbledore

Should Harry's encounter with Dumbledore, and the whole explanation Dumbledore gives Harry be included on this article? Granted, it was vital to the end of the War, but this article is about the Battle of Hogwarts. I propose creating a separate article with the details of the "King's Cross" chapter and adding a link to it in that part of this article. --  Seth Cooper  owl post! 17:07, November 9, 2011 (UTC)

Battle vs. Search For Hocruxes

Hey this article seems to cover mostly the Search for Hocruxes while the battle was going on. Maybe we should make 2 seperate sections for Hocrux Hunt and Battle? I know that this needs fixing already, I just want to check about it. Alumeng 21:12, November 10, 2011 (UTC)

What is that spell?

Beginspells

Spells thrown by Death Eaters to crack/break the shield around hogwarts

In Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows (Part 2), Voldemort broke the shield with the help of his followers, the Death Eaters, and for that fact, I would like to know what spell (s) were used? It could be Expulso, because it is a ball of light, it couldn be Confringo because it throws fire and it couldn't be Bombarda. What do you think?. Dobby4ever 15:24, November 20, 2011 (UTC)

in the flim, who notices that Afetr Harry jumps from hagrids arms, the music OBVIOUSLY gets dramatic and loud, but if you listen carefully you hear draco shout "POTTER!" And Harry holds his arms out and draco throws his wand at Harry so that he can fight. Draco helped him! As he should, harry saved his life once in the movie, twice in the book. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 114.77.44.138 (Talk) (talkcontribs).

Anyone know where this photo was found, and if it's in any additional scenes etc?
Normal mURI temp cba11769

Minerva McGonagall fighting in the Great Hall

—The preceding unsigned comment was added by YaxleySnape (talkcontribs).

I don't know where the uploader has found it. But I saw it yet on a german site: www.harrypotter-xperts.de. Perhaps that helps.  Harry granger   Talk   contribs 13:08, December 28, 2011 (UTC)

Where was ths found?

i'm interested in finding out where this picture was found (documentaries etc)

Character Art Gallery?

Since some Official Charater Art has been released for the Battle of Hogwarts, could we make a gallery to put on this page?

Shadow Seer 04:49, February 28, 2012 (UTC)Shadow Seer

Bloated Article

This has so much detail (some of which is straight out of the film, such as references to the covered bridge) that it seems there is less text in the book itself. Can someone edit this down? Oftenl8 (talk) 05:26, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

Narcissa and Harry

When Narcissa checked Harry for signs of life after his time in Limbo, and she found out Draco was alive and called out "HE IS DEAD", why did Voldemort not know she was lying? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.99.140.120 (talkcontribs).

Well, I can think of two possibilities. 1.) That she could be a skilled Occlumens or 2.) Voldemort, flush with triumph and a bit overconfident, was willing to take her at her word. Yes, it's true that Voldemort is an extremely skilled Legilimens, but presumably he would still have to apply those skills in order to detect if someone was lying. If he wasn't even trying, then she could get away with it even without any attempt to protect her mind. ProfessorTofty (talk) 05:20, April 28, 2013 (UTC)

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